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	<title>Comments on: Global Warming: Science, Economics, or Politics?</title>
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		<title>By: USA / Michael Roberts</title>
		<link>http://www.balkingpoints.com/balk/archives/453#comment-1999</link>
		<dc:creator>USA / Michael Roberts</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 Jul 2010 15:20:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.balkingpoints.com/balk/?p=453#comment-1999</guid>
		<description>It is easy to confuse meteorology and climatology, just as it&#039;s easy to conflate scientific rigor with scientific doubt, and anecdotal evidence with empirical evidence.

Scientists perform experiments more to disprove hypotheses than to confirm them; in this way, only those hypotheses with merit survive. But their professional skepticism makes it easy to cherry-pick odd data or isolated research to make it look as if there is an actual dispute among climate scientists, and doing so has evolved into a cultural meme.

32 national academies of science concur: anthropogenic climate change is real. Rigorously peer-reviewed science is available by the ream. But for some reason the media seem to think the story needs to be artificially &quot;balanced&quot; by finding &quot;the other side,&quot; thereby reinforcing the meme. In this sense, McLuhan was right: the medium BECOMES the message, and the message (erroneous) is that there is legitimate debate.

For some reason, people seem to forbear a climate debate, while none would endure a debate between a geographer and a flat-Earther, or an obstetrician and a storkist. Would they also mandate that discussions of the Holocaust include Mahmoud Ahmadinejad for &quot;balance?&quot;

I suppose in any field it might be possible to find one or two well educated people whose world view taints their science or amps-up their cognitive dissonance. For example, Dr. Kurt Wise is a Harvard-trained geologist and member of the Geological Society of America, but he&#039;s also a &quot;young Earth creationist&quot; who swears the planet is just 6,000 years old and that the Flintstones was nonfiction. His credentials are impeccable, but he&#039;s still delusional.

There might be one or two like him on the GW denial side, but they&#039;re easy to spot. They&#039;re the ones at the conference reception standing off by themselves.

The central intellectual dishonesty in the GW debate is the debate itself.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It is easy to confuse meteorology and climatology, just as it&#8217;s easy to conflate scientific rigor with scientific doubt, and anecdotal evidence with empirical evidence.</p>
<p>Scientists perform experiments more to disprove hypotheses than to confirm them; in this way, only those hypotheses with merit survive. But their professional skepticism makes it easy to cherry-pick odd data or isolated research to make it look as if there is an actual dispute among climate scientists, and doing so has evolved into a cultural meme.</p>
<p>32 national academies of science concur: anthropogenic climate change is real. Rigorously peer-reviewed science is available by the ream. But for some reason the media seem to think the story needs to be artificially &#8220;balanced&#8221; by finding &#8220;the other side,&#8221; thereby reinforcing the meme. In this sense, McLuhan was right: the medium BECOMES the message, and the message (erroneous) is that there is legitimate debate.</p>
<p>For some reason, people seem to forbear a climate debate, while none would endure a debate between a geographer and a flat-Earther, or an obstetrician and a storkist. Would they also mandate that discussions of the Holocaust include Mahmoud Ahmadinejad for &#8220;balance?&#8221;</p>
<p>I suppose in any field it might be possible to find one or two well educated people whose world view taints their science or amps-up their cognitive dissonance. For example, Dr. Kurt Wise is a Harvard-trained geologist and member of the Geological Society of America, but he&#8217;s also a &#8220;young Earth creationist&#8221; who swears the planet is just 6,000 years old and that the Flintstones was nonfiction. His credentials are impeccable, but he&#8217;s still delusional.</p>
<p>There might be one or two like him on the GW denial side, but they&#8217;re easy to spot. They&#8217;re the ones at the conference reception standing off by themselves.</p>
<p>The central intellectual dishonesty in the GW debate is the debate itself.</p>
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		<title>By: HomeBuilding USA</title>
		<link>http://www.balkingpoints.com/balk/archives/453#comment-1220</link>
		<dc:creator>HomeBuilding USA</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 26 Aug 2009 04:00:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.balkingpoints.com/balk/?p=453#comment-1220</guid>
		<description>Here in the Central Midwestern USA summer, less than 150 miles away from my home, record high LOW temps for a day have been followed only days later by record low LOW temperatures for another day.  (a good deal of this stuff, including almanacs of previous conditions all over the U.S. are followed at &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.wunderground.com&quot; target=&quot;blank&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;www.wunderground.com&lt;/a&gt;) 

This may not mean much in the larger scheme of things, but most honest oldsters believe that the climate is now more variable.

But, of course, the weather was absolutely catastrophic in the 1930s and most now believe that the severe drought was exacerbated by plowing under hundreds of thousands of square miles of prairie grass, leaving bare soil for the &quot;Dust Bowl.&quot;

Of these two things I&#039;m certain:

I. Using less fuel per person can hardly be a bad thing (and driving an SUV is hardly virtuous)  Less oil revenue-related conflict plus cleaner air* are good things, right?

II. The snows of Kilimanjaro ARE disappearing--but it&#039;s pretty tough to say just where that water vapor went, isn&#039;t it?

*Roy, I&#039;ve got a little 50 mpg diesel and I&#039;m ready (mostly) for your algae !</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Here in the Central Midwestern USA summer, less than 150 miles away from my home, record high LOW temps for a day have been followed only days later by record low LOW temperatures for another day.  (a good deal of this stuff, including almanacs of previous conditions all over the U.S. are followed at <a href="http://www.wunderground.com"  target="blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.wunderground.com</a>) </p>
<p>This may not mean much in the larger scheme of things, but most honest oldsters believe that the climate is now more variable.</p>
<p>But, of course, the weather was absolutely catastrophic in the 1930s and most now believe that the severe drought was exacerbated by plowing under hundreds of thousands of square miles of prairie grass, leaving bare soil for the &#8220;Dust Bowl.&#8221;</p>
<p>Of these two things I&#8217;m certain:</p>
<p>I. Using less fuel per person can hardly be a bad thing (and driving an SUV is hardly virtuous)  Less oil revenue-related conflict plus cleaner air* are good things, right?</p>
<p>II. The snows of Kilimanjaro ARE disappearing&#8211;but it&#8217;s pretty tough to say just where that water vapor went, isn&#8217;t it?</p>
<p>*Roy, I&#8217;ve got a little 50 mpg diesel and I&#8217;m ready (mostly) for your algae !</p>
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		<title>By: Roy G</title>
		<link>http://www.balkingpoints.com/balk/archives/453#comment-983</link>
		<dc:creator>Roy G</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 26 Jul 2009 04:51:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.balkingpoints.com/balk/?p=453#comment-983</guid>
		<description>That is really an awful situation. Are you able to leave Dawna, or are you 
in a safe part of TJ somehow?

I heard that there was an arrest today (Saturday) in the murder of agent Rosas.

There is some serious talk now in California about legalizing marijuana, 
in order to tax it because the state is running a major deficit and issuing IOU&#039;s instead of checks to it&#039;s creditors. But folded into the idea is an alleviation of demand for illegal marijuana imported by the cartels of course.

However I believe they traffic in other drugs also, which are not on the table for legalization anywhere in the U.S.

The U.S. has put a lot of effort in the last 10 years in patrolling the border better - more agents I believe, new surveillance technologies and of course the fence they started building. Obviously it&#039;s not nearly enough interdiction at this point. What a mess...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That is really an awful situation. Are you able to leave Dawna, or are you<br />
in a safe part of TJ somehow?</p>
<p>I heard that there was an arrest today (Saturday) in the murder of agent Rosas.</p>
<p>There is some serious talk now in California about legalizing marijuana,<br />
in order to tax it because the state is running a major deficit and issuing IOU&#8217;s instead of checks to it&#8217;s creditors. But folded into the idea is an alleviation of demand for illegal marijuana imported by the cartels of course.</p>
<p>However I believe they traffic in other drugs also, which are not on the table for legalization anywhere in the U.S.</p>
<p>The U.S. has put a lot of effort in the last 10 years in patrolling the border better &#8211; more agents I believe, new surveillance technologies and of course the fence they started building. Obviously it&#8217;s not nearly enough interdiction at this point. What a mess&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Dawna</title>
		<link>http://www.balkingpoints.com/balk/archives/453#comment-975</link>
		<dc:creator>Dawna</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 24 Jul 2009 23:28:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.balkingpoints.com/balk/?p=453#comment-975</guid>
		<description>Last night near Tijuana, another tragic shooting.  A U.S. Border Patrol Agent, shot and killed at 9:15 pm by presumed illegals along the border between Campo CA and 18 miles east of Tecate, a rugged rocky area used as a smuggling route. The shooters still at large.

STATEMENT BY HOMELAND SECURITY SECRETARY JANET NAPOLITANO ON THE DEATH OF BORDER PATROL AGENT 
ROBERT ROSAS

“I am deeply saddened by the tragic death of one of our own. Agent Robert Rosas was gunned down while protecting our nation’s Southwest border. This act of violence will not stand—nor will any act of violence against the Border Patrol. I have directed that the full resources of the Department assist in the investigation to find and bring to justice those responsible for this inexcusable crime.

“My thoughts and condolences are with Agent Rosas’ family and his fellow agents at this difficult time. I want to commend those in the law enforcement and first responder community in Southern California for so quickly responding to the scene and attempting to save Agent Rosas’ life. His death is a vivid reminder that we are engaged in a serious effort to secure our border and that thousands of Border Patrol agents and other DHS employees risk their lives every single day to protect and defend our nation.”</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Last night near Tijuana, another tragic shooting.  A U.S. Border Patrol Agent, shot and killed at 9:15 pm by presumed illegals along the border between Campo CA and 18 miles east of Tecate, a rugged rocky area used as a smuggling route. The shooters still at large.</p>
<p>STATEMENT BY HOMELAND SECURITY SECRETARY JANET NAPOLITANO ON THE DEATH OF BORDER PATROL AGENT<br />
ROBERT ROSAS</p>
<p>“I am deeply saddened by the tragic death of one of our own. Agent Robert Rosas was gunned down while protecting our nation’s Southwest border. This act of violence will not stand—nor will any act of violence against the Border Patrol. I have directed that the full resources of the Department assist in the investigation to find and bring to justice those responsible for this inexcusable crime.</p>
<p>“My thoughts and condolences are with Agent Rosas’ family and his fellow agents at this difficult time. I want to commend those in the law enforcement and first responder community in Southern California for so quickly responding to the scene and attempting to save Agent Rosas’ life. His death is a vivid reminder that we are engaged in a serious effort to secure our border and that thousands of Border Patrol agents and other DHS employees risk their lives every single day to protect and defend our nation.”</p>
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		<title>By: Dawna</title>
		<link>http://www.balkingpoints.com/balk/archives/453#comment-972</link>
		<dc:creator>Dawna</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Jul 2009 17:17:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.balkingpoints.com/balk/?p=453#comment-972</guid>
		<description>Yes, Tijuana is a mess right now.  The war is not just between the Drug Cartels and the Mexican govt., its a bloody battle between two drug cartels vying for control of this lucrative route. As the cartels kill cops, and the opposing cartels kill each other, bystander get in the cross-fire regularly. Literally, blood runs down the streets, heads without bodies and bodies without heads are found routinely, or fragments of unidentifiable dissolved persons are found in acid barrels in commercial areas in broad daylight.

Parts of Mexico now rank among the most dangerous in the world. However, this isn’t some nameless African state, it is a major US trading partner, a member of NAFTA, the world’s eleventh largest economy by GDP at purchasing power parity and a popular tourist destination for westerners. What has precipitated this absolute collapse in the security situation in great chunks of the country? The Cause: Drugs. Simply put, the operation of the drug cartels in Mexico is responsible for almost bringing Mexico to its knees.
The Tijuana cartels are not bit-players. A couple of days ago in Tijuana, a member of the El Teo cartel was arrested while carrying drugs, guns, jewelry and $3.6 MILLION US Dollars CASH.  I mean really, can you imagine walking around Tijuana with $3.5 million dollars cash? Surreal.
Well, welcome to TJ! And thanks for asking...Dawna</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes, Tijuana is a mess right now.  The war is not just between the Drug Cartels and the Mexican govt., its a bloody battle between two drug cartels vying for control of this lucrative route. As the cartels kill cops, and the opposing cartels kill each other, bystander get in the cross-fire regularly. Literally, blood runs down the streets, heads without bodies and bodies without heads are found routinely, or fragments of unidentifiable dissolved persons are found in acid barrels in commercial areas in broad daylight.</p>
<p>Parts of Mexico now rank among the most dangerous in the world. However, this isn’t some nameless African state, it is a major US trading partner, a member of NAFTA, the world’s eleventh largest economy by GDP at purchasing power parity and a popular tourist destination for westerners. What has precipitated this absolute collapse in the security situation in great chunks of the country? The Cause: Drugs. Simply put, the operation of the drug cartels in Mexico is responsible for almost bringing Mexico to its knees.<br />
The Tijuana cartels are not bit-players. A couple of days ago in Tijuana, a member of the El Teo cartel was arrested while carrying drugs, guns, jewelry and $3.6 MILLION US Dollars CASH.  I mean really, can you imagine walking around Tijuana with $3.5 million dollars cash? Surreal.<br />
Well, welcome to TJ! And thanks for asking&#8230;Dawna</p>
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		<title>By: Roy G</title>
		<link>http://www.balkingpoints.com/balk/archives/453#comment-943</link>
		<dc:creator>Roy G</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 18 Jul 2009 05:19:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.balkingpoints.com/balk/?p=453#comment-943</guid>
		<description>Welcome back Dawna. We hear on U.S. commercial media that Tijuana 
is a mess right now, with a war between drug cartels and the Mexican government. How are you finding that?

First I’ve heard of trying to manipulate hurricane strength with cold water - good post. Supposedly man has made recent hurricanes more intense artificially via global warming, so wouldn’t this be one way to reverse that in a small area? Wouldn’t we be also cooling the waters (if real) with a human intervention of reducing carbon emissions?

These are vexing questions… ;^)

I’m skeptical however that anyone could possibly transport &amp; drop, or cool &amp; pump from a ship on location or something, enough cold water to make a significant dent in ocean temperature. I&#039;d like to see that demonstrated.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Welcome back Dawna. We hear on U.S. commercial media that Tijuana<br />
is a mess right now, with a war between drug cartels and the Mexican government. How are you finding that?</p>
<p>First I’ve heard of trying to manipulate hurricane strength with cold water &#8211; good post. Supposedly man has made recent hurricanes more intense artificially via global warming, so wouldn’t this be one way to reverse that in a small area? Wouldn’t we be also cooling the waters (if real) with a human intervention of reducing carbon emissions?</p>
<p>These are vexing questions… ;^)</p>
<p>I’m skeptical however that anyone could possibly transport &amp; drop, or cool &amp; pump from a ship on location or something, enough cold water to make a significant dent in ocean temperature. I&#8217;d like to see that demonstrated.</p>
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		<title>By: Dawna Mexico</title>
		<link>http://www.balkingpoints.com/balk/archives/453#comment-940</link>
		<dc:creator>Dawna Mexico</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 18 Jul 2009 00:39:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.balkingpoints.com/balk/?p=453#comment-940</guid>
		<description>Hurricanes serve the natural purpose of re-distributing hot air, hot water, cooling off those hot parts of the oceans.  I lived in Barbadoes for two years and got blown about by a few hurricanes, Hurricane Ivan in 2004 about swept me and the Kentucky Fried Chicken sign right over the sea wall, YIKES. In 2005, the hurricane names went all the way through the alphabet and started over again, very active that summer.  Cuba seemed to get slammed over and over, and Hurricane Wilma cancelled my honeymoon in the Riviera Maya/Yucatan that fall.

But WHAT IF, man could minimize hurricane intensity or path with a strategic douse of cold water in the superheated portion of water energizing the hurricane?  Should he/she do it??

If man did not want hurricane damage on their structures, (like a rich person with a private island) should they try to halt or minimize the intensity of the hurricane if they could?  What would be the impact of purposeful mitigation of hurricanes? I personally don&#039;t think man should mess with Mother Nature that way, but here&#039;s what I heard is afoot... 

I heard today that Bill Gates, with some weather expert scientists, and computer software tracking system he is developing, will track projected path of the hurricane, predicting where it will intensify and analyze the landmass about to take the brunt, and ??? before it gets to land to cause damage, add cold water to the reduce the intensity before it hits land.  The hottest water areas which would have energized the hurricane would then be cooled enough to gentle the storm.  The Gates software would determine which areas of water are the most heated and would likely intensify the force(say in the Caribbean or Gulf of Mexico by Jamaica for example). After figuring out the most heated water area which would intensify the force of the hurricane, they look at the land damage anticipated, say south of the Florida keys, add cold water, and PRESTO, a gentle misty rain storm instead of Hurricane Andrew.
I don&#039;t like it, even if it works, but what do YOU think????

(As I write, now I&#039;m sitting in a drought here in Tijuana, so that cool water sounds like it could be of better use here than dumped in the Gulf of Mexico in front of a hurricane.  In fact, I&#039;m kind of missing a blustery rain storm right about now. :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hurricanes serve the natural purpose of re-distributing hot air, hot water, cooling off those hot parts of the oceans.  I lived in Barbadoes for two years and got blown about by a few hurricanes, Hurricane Ivan in 2004 about swept me and the Kentucky Fried Chicken sign right over the sea wall, YIKES. In 2005, the hurricane names went all the way through the alphabet and started over again, very active that summer.  Cuba seemed to get slammed over and over, and Hurricane Wilma cancelled my honeymoon in the Riviera Maya/Yucatan that fall.</p>
<p>But WHAT IF, man could minimize hurricane intensity or path with a strategic douse of cold water in the superheated portion of water energizing the hurricane?  Should he/she do it??</p>
<p>If man did not want hurricane damage on their structures, (like a rich person with a private island) should they try to halt or minimize the intensity of the hurricane if they could?  What would be the impact of purposeful mitigation of hurricanes? I personally don&#8217;t think man should mess with Mother Nature that way, but here&#8217;s what I heard is afoot&#8230; </p>
<p>I heard today that Bill Gates, with some weather expert scientists, and computer software tracking system he is developing, will track projected path of the hurricane, predicting where it will intensify and analyze the landmass about to take the brunt, and ??? before it gets to land to cause damage, add cold water to the reduce the intensity before it hits land.  The hottest water areas which would have energized the hurricane would then be cooled enough to gentle the storm.  The Gates software would determine which areas of water are the most heated and would likely intensify the force(say in the Caribbean or Gulf of Mexico by Jamaica for example). After figuring out the most heated water area which would intensify the force of the hurricane, they look at the land damage anticipated, say south of the Florida keys, add cold water, and PRESTO, a gentle misty rain storm instead of Hurricane Andrew.<br />
I don&#8217;t like it, even if it works, but what do YOU think????</p>
<p>(As I write, now I&#8217;m sitting in a drought here in Tijuana, so that cool water sounds like it could be of better use here than dumped in the Gulf of Mexico in front of a hurricane.  In fact, I&#8217;m kind of missing a blustery rain storm right about now. :)</p>
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		<title>By: Ecomike</title>
		<link>http://www.balkingpoints.com/balk/archives/453#comment-892</link>
		<dc:creator>Ecomike</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Jul 2009 01:00:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.balkingpoints.com/balk/?p=453#comment-892</guid>
		<description>The mini ice age while America was being settled from Europe wasn&#039;t that long ago. Proof of which is the millions of beer and whiskey drinkers we have as opposed to the wine drinkers still in the south of Europe. Grain was the only thing they could grow and ferment. Famine forced a lot of those people to migrate to the states while southern Europe could stay put. Napoleon&#039;s pilage, burn and run strategy helped with that too. A major volcano eruption clouded Asia first and then the States near the end of that period producing the summerless year where it peaked and has since been warming ever since. What kept it from being a full fledged ice age no one knows for sure. But at this warming trend it sure doesn&#039;t seem to be wise to fool with mother nature and do anything to increase the trend because the earth will rebound, one way or the other. What&#039;s scarier? The population chart that seems to hit the baby boomer era and change from a steady rise to a bolt to the ceiling.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The mini ice age while America was being settled from Europe wasn&#8217;t that long ago. Proof of which is the millions of beer and whiskey drinkers we have as opposed to the wine drinkers still in the south of Europe. Grain was the only thing they could grow and ferment. Famine forced a lot of those people to migrate to the states while southern Europe could stay put. Napoleon&#8217;s pilage, burn and run strategy helped with that too. A major volcano eruption clouded Asia first and then the States near the end of that period producing the summerless year where it peaked and has since been warming ever since. What kept it from being a full fledged ice age no one knows for sure. But at this warming trend it sure doesn&#8217;t seem to be wise to fool with mother nature and do anything to increase the trend because the earth will rebound, one way or the other. What&#8217;s scarier? The population chart that seems to hit the baby boomer era and change from a steady rise to a bolt to the ceiling.</p>
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		<title>By: Roy G</title>
		<link>http://www.balkingpoints.com/balk/archives/453#comment-845</link>
		<dc:creator>Roy G</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 06 Jul 2009 05:05:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.balkingpoints.com/balk/?p=453#comment-845</guid>
		<description>Welcome to B/P Ken &amp; Rob - good remarks.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Welcome to B/P Ken &amp; Rob &#8211; good remarks.</p>
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		<title>By: Rob, Westfir, Oregon</title>
		<link>http://www.balkingpoints.com/balk/archives/453#comment-827</link>
		<dc:creator>Rob, Westfir, Oregon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 04 Jul 2009 18:13:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.balkingpoints.com/balk/?p=453#comment-827</guid>
		<description>This sums up my opinion of mans effects on climate change.
  If the ice caps on Mars are shrinking, who is the cause of that change???
  What are those Martians doing to their planet?? How can they change thier climate???</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This sums up my opinion of mans effects on climate change.<br />
  If the ice caps on Mars are shrinking, who is the cause of that change???<br />
  What are those Martians doing to their planet?? How can they change thier climate???</p>
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